Jacqueline Norton: Good. Good afternoon. Hello, this is Jacq from Authentic Artists. And in our next artist spotlight, I am delighted to welcome the lovely Hattie to the call. Hello, Hattie. Hattie Murdoch: Hello, thanks for having me. Jacqueline Norton: You’re very welcome. It’s a delight. And so thanks for agreeing to be in the spotlight for this call. And I want to really just kind of let people know who you are, what you do. And then we’ll we’ll talk about, you know, how you came to work with me on the coaching, etc. So do you want to give me a bit of an intro? Hattie Murdoch: And, yes, where do I start? Right. And so I’m Hattie. And this is where you go hang on your pitch working, we know, we still have a bit more to do. But I’m Hattie, I’m a songwriter, I’m a singer, I’m a producer, and kind of all around musician, full time musician, and freelancer. And, yes, that I met you Jacq, a while back at one of the events you put on, like it was an open mic type thing, but I’d come very late. And I sort of gone Hi, hi, oh, and it was all a bit too much. And then I’ve properly got to meet you at a writing retreat that we did together. And that’s when I met you at the right time, you’re the right person to meet at the right time. And we got on anyway, you know, outside of Authentic Artists. And I just really like, you know, you and your aura and your personality. So we got on with that. And then the Authentic Artist side became more apparent, you did a talk. And that’s when I was like, “I think this is what I need”. And I didn’t realise I needed it at that time. So yeah, so that’s, that’s how we met. Um, and I’ve been freelancing for four years full time. And I’ve been a musician for years and years and years, and I’ve done a bit of everything from setting up a record label. And, you know, I really hammered it as an artist for about five years, and, you know, gigs, toward festivals, releases all this kind of thing. And then I was kind of solely a songwriter, and producer for three years, which just kind of started to expand again this year to bring the artist side back into it. And then the on the other side, I work full time as a gigging musician as well. So that is, like a big part of my income. Yes. So yes, that’s probably sort of me in a nutshell of who I am. And how in there. Jacqueline Norton: Yeah, no, thank you for that. I mean, it just gives people that context is to, you know, what you do. So, in terms of that meeting, when I did do that, to talk about Authentic Artists and coaching and what I do, what was it that you heard in there that you thought, that’s what I need? Where were you in your business and your music journey at that time? And why did you decide to work with me? Hattie Murdoch: So I think I met you quite a pivotal point, actually. And so I’d been working as a say, solely as a songwriter on that side. So I’ll just put this into context as well, I’ve kind of got three sides to my business, and one is the gigging and, you know, doing events, covers gigs, bars, restaurants, weddings, that kind of thing. So we’ll put all that to one side, so and so. Yeah, that’s the bread and butter will put all that over there somewhere, that’s a different hat. And so what is a writer and artist, I showed the artist side for quite a long time focus purely on writing, building my studio up and building clients, you know, and just was doing a lot of a pitches a lot longer brief writing that kind of thing. And, and so I was signed to a publisher, and I came out of that deal earlier this year. So it didn’t, I think, coming out of a deal, I think coming out of any contract can be quite, it changes your mind on a few things. And it’s always time to reassess. And that’s where I was, where I met you in March, I was starting to reassess what was working what wasn’t, wasn’t happy doing with exactly what I was doing. And it had been, you know, in the back of my mind, there was still there’s still things I wanted to say, as an artist. And, and it really, you know, people are asking me, are you putting things out, you know, like you should, and I’ve spoken to somebody, I think I’d kept them very separate. Because as a songwriter, as I go, I will that’s most often then, you know, writing for the people, like, you know, this person, very, you know, big songwriter, he was like, putting your own stuff out does not harm you as a songwriter, if you’re working, you know, and I really started to change my mind and it started to formulate a gang, actually, you know, I still have all my connections, I think I can still put stuff out. And it will say what I want to say and maybe even allow myself to kind of express myself, excuse the dog. Lexi apologise for that. And, it was a chance for me to express myself in a way that I couldn’t writing with and for other people. So Lexi, – I can’t whistle. Right. So and yes, to lost my train of thought I, of course. Jacqueline Norton: So you wanted to be an artist as well, because you’ve got things you still want to say. Hattie Murdoch: Yeah, exactly. Yeah, in a really felt just right at the right time, it was quite pivotal in my personal life as well, I was going through quite a lot of change. And, and I just felt like I still have something to give and something to offer. So when I met you in March, it was the first time that I’d gone to a writing retreat, and actually said, you know, what, I’d be happy to write for myself, you know, going into it into a group. And that was a quite a big thing for me to say. And, and yeah, so. So from that I was just like, Oh, goodness, this whole lot of infrastructure that I forgotten about, like, it’s been so long since I’ve had to really do this properly. That I was like, Who am I? As you know, as you know, I’ve been trying to write all this different stuff for so many years. What brings me down to me, what, what can I sell at shows, you know, what is my USP? I guess, and you never want us to look at yourself as a product. But yeah, you have to, and you have to come back around to that and go, okay, right. Don’t be yourself. You could be self indulgent, of course, but you have to separate yourself often what I wasn’t, like very well prepared to do. So when you talked about Authentic Artists, it was it is that missing link for me, it was like, I’m, you know, need to be asked the right questions. And I think that was the part for me, that really got me and I was like, I was ready to talk about myself as an artist and really start to get this infrastructure going. Jacqueline Norton: It’s really interesting, isn’t it that you said that, because you’re right, I talk about this with a lot of people is, is that you, you do have to separate yourself slightly and think of yourself as product. But the trick is still being authentic. While doing that, we’re not kind of creating some disconnected persona that doesn’t really, you know, kind of reflect or project who you are, and who you want to how you want to communicate with your audience. So that separation, that can be a bit tricky. And I think, you know, what was nice is seeing, you know how you thought about that, as we went through our process, you know, and how you kind of reassess that kind of position that you wanted to, to establish? Hattie Murdoch: Yeah, I think I’m just bringing that hat back for a slightly, the gigging musician side of me, I’ve managed to create a persona and a product that I found very easy to create actually scary, easy. And that I could relate with wedding clients, I can relate with venues relate with agencies, that I could sell myself as a product. I, you know, and I could say what I need to do on social media in a way that suited that. And I found it really, really easy, and then really confused me why I was really struggling to do this for myself. And because of that attachment to what you want to say and how you want to say it. And you just because you want to make Authentic, you don’t want to see it as a product. So it’s a change of mindset, which you really, really helped me with, by sort of, very gently kind of asking me about the fundamentals of which I, when you, for me as a solo artist, and I don’t even have the band anymore, I’m doing everything, even, you know, gig wise with the show and stuff with the loops, and you’ve got nobody to bounce things off. So you haven’t got somebody to go, that should be your next single, or, you know, and you don’t necessarily need or want somebody to say that, because you’re probably only going to go No, I’m going to do my way. But you do need a little bit of gentle, you know, moulding of just going What about this? What about this? What do you think about this? How would you do it? And that’s what you did for me? And you know, you you just gave me a little bit better structure around so it wasn’t just this fog of I’m an artist, Oh, goodness, gracious, what do I do next? How do I release stuff? Again, I forgotten? Jacqueline Norton: Had you ever worked with a coach on anything before? Hattie Murdoch: I’ve worked with a songwriting coach. And and in the publishing I had, like, you know, strong mentorship for the first couple of years of, you know, really working about strategy and in depth, you know, about making my connections and, you know, down to try rewriting that pre chorus or this on the other side have coaching on that side of things. Yeah, but really, I think my missing piece on that side was I was struggling to figure out what I brought to every session, I was trying to as a songwriter, what I was bringing to every session, I was trying to be 100 songwriters in one. And I really felt like I could have maybe have done with that, during that period, having someone to go right, your personality is a little bit late, maybe like this. So how about you know, you try doing this and that will make you feel more confident and those sessions or almost a bit more pastoral kind of care? Um, so yeah. So yes, I have a coaching but not like from a personality level? Does that make sense? Jacqueline Norton: Yeah, Yeah, it does. It’s interesting to me as well, that the coaching that I do, which is, you know, primarily focused on the business side of the music business, because my background is not in, in music, as you know, so, you know, that’s not my expertise, but it’s about how you are running your business. Within that. So, you know, from right off, you know, the kind of even how you structure your day, type kind of approaches that, you know, just needed a bit reframing and I think you will actually quite hard on yourself as well, you know, that was, you know, needed a bit of reflection back to you to sort of say, you know, you can’t do it, you can’t. In fact, one of them, if you if you don’t mind me saying is is you know, gigging all night and then thinking you should get up, you know, start work at 8am and go all day and then all night again, that mean, that’s just not sustainable. And it’s not sensible from a health or mental health point of view. So just the permission to not have to do that all the time. Hattie Murdoch: We at any got me know, in. We know, I remember, like our first session, I was up a high, because I think I had like, three or four recording projects going on, that I was trying to do during the day. But then I was also doing like four or five weddings that week. And then I was, you know, trying to sort everything out. And then I had the coaching and I was like, I gotta think about being an artist as well, what the hell you got me on like a real day was I Oh god, don’t know what I’m doing. And he brought me back down. And to the point where like, I couldn’t actually think about being an artist. So what I’d signed up with you to talk about, we didn’t actually talk about for two or three sessions, I don’t think was it like? Because you, I was just struggling to get through the backlog of of work that I had with the recording projects, you know, of just didn’t feel like there was enough time in the day, enough time in the week and then being exhausted and then frustrated at myself, because I couldn’t focus. So that really, really helped me. And, you know, I’ve carried that on, you know, ever since, you know, I’ve really kind of worked my weeks, I try and focus on a Sunday to maybe think about what I’m doing during the week. And when can I take time off? And I think that’s so it’s not necessarily what am I going to do during the week is when do I have time off. And it’s coming to a point now, the summer goes a bit crazy with gigs, but I’m at a point where it’s like, I can almost take a regular Monday off, even if I’m gigging an evening, I take the daytime off, and go, you know, I’m going to sort out, you know, clothes, washing supermarket shop, all that kind of thing. Because without that in place, I can’t really get on with anything else. Jacqueline Norton: Yeah, there’s got to be time for your life. Yeah, I mean,this is the thing, you know, that just the permission even to say, okay, you know, when am I going to focus on kind of chunking things together in terms of I’m going to have a slab of time, that’s just on my production, I’m going to get because you were feeling a bit guilty as well about being behind with some of the delivery of that for other people. Yeah. So you know, just getting that backlog cleared, and giving yourself permission to not have to put the pressure on forging ahead with new stuff all the time. And getting some completion done. Yeah. And freed up some time as well. So yeah, you’re right, it was kind of life stuff to kind of get yourself grounded and, you know, in a good place, so that you could then think about, what do you want to achieve with your artist projects? Hattie Murdoch: Yeah, yeah, it wasn’t. And I think almost when I take on too much stuff, the artist side, because, for me, it’s sometimes feel self indulgent, goes off to one side. And I think, you know, a lot of people will relate with that. And, you know, if you’re trying to balance and and juggle a freelance job, it’s very much like, Oh, well, nobody’s pressurised me for that. It’s just me who wants that. And, you know, it’s, it’s turning that into the worth, that the other aspects of your business have as well. And just going, you know, what, this has the potential to make as much money as the other parts. If I put the time in, it’s not going to happen if I didn’t put any time and so freeing up that time to do this was so important, I think as well. I knew I had festival slots already booked in, because even though I say I wasn’t focusing on it, and let it sort of, is trickled on for years. And so like, I’m really lucky that people still book us for some great festival slots, you know, great support slots and, and I felt like I wasn’t delivering exactly, or very focused delivery, and wasting opportunity of those gigs as well, by going right, there’s a room full of people who are listening. And I can’t really give them what they want, because I don’t know, I’m just like, oh, and then the stress of having those gigs booked and going, Oh, goodness, gracious, I thought about that for so long. Jacqueline Norton: Then their looming over you then aren’t they, you know, wow, you know, Hattie Murdoch: it is totally. And so when we started talking about the Artists thing, once we got that, allowing time to actually bring this into there, and the day to day structure, a weekly structured go right, you know, spend some time on yourself. There having these sessions with you helped me focus it on every, every week, or every week, or every two weeks, I can’t remember how we changed the sessions, but like, I was working towards something and there was a bit of accountability there that I didn’t have before. Jacqueline Norton: Yeah, no, that’s great. Okay, well, you know, that’s all brilliant, because I absolutely adored working with you, because you were really committed to making changes, and actually implementing what we discussed and what we agreed was the right thing to do. And, you know, we very much did make that up as we went along. You know, there was no set plan, from my point of view as to what I assumed you would need that that wasn’t the way it was. And that’s not the way I work very much. It’s like, okay, what’s showing up for you? What do you need? what’s getting in the way? And let’s figure that out together? Because you definitely need to be bought into, you know, the, whatever the the answers are the solution, because you won’t do it, if you’re not? Hattie Murdoch: Yeah, and I think there was always a bit in the back of my mind, because I’ve been, you know, I’ve signed up to things online of, you know, write the best song in seven days, and it’ll be number one smasher. And you’re like, all right, okay, yeah, also looked up. And I’ve always been a very wary, you know, I fallen for so many things on the web, on the internet, Jacqueline Norton: We’ve all done that!, Hattie Murdoch: but I’ll see, when I’ve met you, I think, you know, having that personal connection with somebody to go, she’s a real person, you’re not trying to sell me anything you’re not trying to sell a product of this will fix and, you know, mass marketed to, you know, a million people to go, this is how you’re going to do it, there is no set answers. And in although that a lot of the framework I’ve come across, in, in my previous career, so when I was working in offices, I was managing as well. So there’s a lot of, you know, tools that I forgotten about that I also never even really thought about applying them to my music as well. So there was that side, that knowledge, which was so helpful and brilliant. But the fact that you didn’t have a set plan to go, right, this is how it’s going to be, you’re going to work and then you’ll get this result, the end was just so refreshing. And so like, that’s what I needed, I needed someone to go because I don’t think I really knew right at the beginning, I was just like, here’s all the stuff and I don’t know what I need. And you just kind of managed to get that focus and tease out, which took a bit of patience and a lot of skill from your end. Really, it’s from scatty Hattie here, just like ooh, I don’t know what’s going on. Jacqueline Norton: I mean, I loved it, because that’s, you know, that’s what gives me You know, a lot of sort of satisfaction is is seeing you make the changes and then it working. And you You know what, what’s amazing to me is, you know what, you are so talented, and you’ve got such great material and to see you release your songs and and kind of make progress is absolutely the best thing ever for me so that I get you know, it’s great. And what I’d like to kind of kind of finish by asking you as well as So, what’s happened since what results did you actually see? And how has it helped, you know, where are you now. Hattie Murdoch: And so the kind of goal that we got, I guess I like really tangible things that you can go tick that off the list. And so we just go that, you know, I would put out this single that I actually had ready. Gosh, for a good four months, it was totally done, finished, mixed, mastered, absolutely, everything I just had no plan of I didn’t know what to do. So we had and then I had four festival slots with a big one at the end of August. So our kind of focus on our sessions was to get the single out, you know, and you quite rightly gave me the idea of putting the single out on the day of that last festival of the summer, which was great because I had things to shout about every gig It was like you know, this is what’s coming up this is what’s going on. And then actually on the day of the festival I have photographer come she’s filmed a lot of it work put out a little video for the backstage stuff that’s going on over the summer. And now the single came out like I had something to give them I had CDs I made yes those things they do exist still. But I did a load of stuff that I didn’t done for years you know how making all CDs and merch and stuff out which I love doing I’m right crafty. And sameare going to hobby craft hours I brilliant, right? rubbers stampsall sorts great, love it. But, you know. So during this process, I think quite rightly again, with the not only a was that released and the practicalities of a release schedule, and a 90 day plan and a 120 day plan, that kind of thing. And I really is a live show because that’s pretty much where I sit more comfortably now is is always been with the live stuff and I’m having a journey that I can take the audience on, you know, really having stories about, you know, how am I going to connect to the audience? And I must say like every gig I’ve done since people are like, I love that story about that song. I’m so pleased. You’re so interesting. You’ve so funny. And I’m – Is this me? really! But that confidence to go actually naturally how I speak I’m not trying to be somebody else on stage now. I can, you know, go with no plan. I have a set of my setlist, obviously. But I can sort of make up the bit of the banter. But I’m like, what’s my audience like today? Right? How am I going to connect with them? And what songs were story that would they like to hear? And what do with the Great question, you asked me what do you want them to go away with it at the end of the gig. And I really had this vision of, you know, being a strong solo artist, lots of things going on on stage, like tech and loops and this kind of stuff. But for them to go, I really liked your songs and I thought you were really funny. And it didn’t doesn’t matter so much about it, whether the song was sad, or whether the song was happy, or the song was too emotional, or, you know, maybe there’s genre is it the way I connected it with the crack in between, you know, like so that. So for me, the live shows have, you know, it makes so much more sense to me now, I feel very confident as in as an artist, you know it and I’m trying to adapt it, you’ll probably speak to me in three or four months, I’ll be like, I’ve lost it again, I need, I need help. Jacqueline Norton: It will evolve, it will change and evolve, because that’s the thing about, you know, you as a person keep evolving. So you have to make sure your you continue to be authentic. Hattie Murdoch: Yeah. Absoutely. I think that’s my, my, my mom said to me ages ago, you know, and, and you can use this as a lyric, you can credit my mom. But she was that, you know, life is a staircase, it’s, you know, not a continual ladder up and you know, it’s it’s things plateau, things change. And you might go down a bit, you might go up a bit, and the thing is that nothing stays the same. And you should always have to adapt and, and not be scared of that change. Because once you’ve got something right, and you’ve got the fundamentals there, I think you can make little changes, and it’s not so much of this huge big transformation, which is very kind of can be very upsetting. And, you know, a lot of effort and a lot of energy goes into it. And if you can just sort of tweak things as they go along. For me, that makes a lot more sense. And, you know, I mean, it’s different for everybody. But so yeah, so the gig side that’s been a huge thing. I am I think seeing my working schedule is sort of changed a bit I’m trying to bring in some time off which is been huge. And.. Jacqueline Norton: Plan your time off… plan your time off! Hattie Murdoch: Oh my goodness. I couldn’t have like seriously I ran out of socks so many times but now I never run out of socks, it’s great! I was I not did not to keep buying my socks at Primark now I never did I never did have a poor Artists possibly afford that! Jacqueline Norton: No, washing them is great! Hattie Murdoch: Washing them is fab! Someone should have told us about that many moons ago. Well, yeah, that’s it to also like being allowed to go because I do a lot of events over the summer, a lot of weddings and it is taken and to be able to go You know what, I’m not going to take on any recording and work over July and August because there’s not, there’s no point I’m only going to let people down I’m only gonna let myself down. So I think seeing my whole year is a bit of a cycle instead, Okay, you know what that’s going to be mostly focused on gigging, you know, that’s going to be focused on writing, that’s production side, right? And, and then just allowing the fact that I’m not going to have a week that’s ever going to be the same as the next week or the previous week to be able to go, you know, you’re going to be mostly in studio this week, or, you know, next week you’re going to be mostly gigging and just allowing that to be flexible and going with a bit more Jacqueline Norton: It’s got to work for you rather than against you. And, you know, having that forward planning so that you can adapt and, and set your expectations for what you know, whatever it is, you’re focused on at the time, because you’re right, it is in peaks and troughs in different ways. But you absolutely have to look after yourself and your own, you know, mentality. Yeah. So the you aren’t burned out, and you aren’t exhausted, and you have time, you know, to take the dog out, to go and to do your washing and make a pie…! Hattie Murdoch: Yeah, totally. And like I felt you know, so just, for example, this last week, last couple of weeks, I wasn’t very well after the summer and just really busy and came down with the cold and, like physically quite exhausted, I think. And so last week, I just took the majority of the week off. Yeah, I was gigging I saw like seven gigs, Jacqueline Norton: And that was a week off?! Hattie Murdoch: but the day times I was like, week off, daytimes and I was like, You know what, I’m going to sit and watch crap on Netflix. And and or, you know, like, Oh, no, I think I went I think I’m going to Hobbycraft again, you know, if I’m ever missing, I’ll be in an isle in Hobbycraft, Jacqueline Norton: We’ll find you there… Hattie Murdoch: In the papier mache section probably… So that was a huge Yeah, that was a huge thing. And the other the other side is, after everything, you know, that we we’ve talked, I feel like a slightly more in control of, of what or not necessarily in control, it’s probably the wrong word just slightly. Well, I know a bit more what’s going on, and so I’ve got the single came at the end of August. And so I’m working with my producer. Because I don’t I don’t produce my own stuff, because nothing would ever come out ever. I wouldn’t, I would never sign anything off. And so I’ve been talking with him, I’ve got my demo sorted for the next few singles. And we’re just trying to work out a strategy now it’s like, I’ve got five songs in the running really for the next single in it. So which one are we going to do like getting a strategy instead of going, I’ve only got one song that you know, and this is a change in direction for me as an artist, this song that came out in August, and it’s a now is exciting to think about the follow up and have been writing a lot more in, you know, I’ve been writing more authentically for me as an artist. And that’s really exciting to have a bunch of songs that I’m super proud of. And I’m really excited to get the next one out. And so there’s that side on the artist, which is which is fab gigs are sort I’ve talked about then the other thing is, is I really struggled with like being in the same house. So having my studio in the flat and I felt like this separation has been really, really hard. And they never turned off. You know, it’s always like, you know, the rooms here, okay, well, I’ve come back from a gig, all my vocals are pretty good. Actually, at the moment, I’ve been singing all day, I might as well just lay a vocal down, let’s just do that now. And, and then like, not really chilling out. And so I’m, I’ve had it in the long game for a while, but I’ve just signed a lease for room and for which will be studios, I can move this studio out into a separate. And, yeah, separate building, basically. And that’s also another four or five rooms, which of all musicians in so it’s like going into a community and I think I’ve kind of pulled myself away from things and tried to do so much on my own. And that I realised, you know, by even by taking the step of having you as a coach, I’ve gone I need people, I can’t do this on my own, and then need to be around people. And I think moving the studio into into another studio is like, I’m so excited. So hopefully, will it’s getting built now. So it should be ready in a month. And so that I think that for me, it’s been like a follow on an unexpected result of of me kind of reviewing exactly what’s going on with all the music. Well, every Jacqueline Norton: it’s about knowing what you need as well. And if you need, you know, structure and other people and support, you know, and then you were able to understand that that’s okay to need those things, you and then work with that to build that into your life. And that’s such a positive thing because you can go to work, and then do your work. And then you can come home and relax. Yeah, so, you know, brilliant. I’m really chuffed by that. Because I think that’s a really positive thing. But you just kind of skipped over. Tell me more about what happened with your single. Hattie Murdoch: So get the signal. Oh, it’s done really well, like really, really unexpected. And because, I mean, it was a bit of a learning curve. Like everybody said, you need to get stuff to press six weeks before.Two weeks before I realised now press is going out for like, I was like damn everybody said that for a reason. So I really didn’t think but it’s a learning curve. It’s like, I reconnected with a few people in the press, like, especially in the local, the guys that I used to know, and reconnected with them. And so for the next single, I’m a bit more aware, of what I need to do. So I thought I was like, oh, I’ve missed the boat on this. So I’m gonna put this single out like nobody will, you know, but I’ll be pleased I will please I’ve done it and I’ve plugged it shows that will be great. And and then I submitted to BBC Introducing and those guys have always been really supportive previously. And yeah, so they put on the Northeast Introducing and and then that got picked up by the nationals. So we’ve got it onto Tom Robertson’s Radio 6 show, which was like, I was walking the dog Jacq like, I’d come I done this god awful gig as well – it was awful. And I was walking the dog, it’s about midnight, I’ll check my twitter and I never check my Twitter. And I was like, oh, my goodness, I’ve got it. And I was like this to the dog. Yes, we did it. We You know, it was just so unexpected. And I think that was like, Oh my goodness, I haven’t had this for so long like you know, people really behind erm something that I’ve put out and and real because I put a did put the effort in and I got excited and put a little show reel together and put a little promo videos and tried to put my personality into those videos as well, instead of trying to be somebody else, you know, and I think that really helped. I think people are starting to get a little bit more of maybe who I am. I’m starting to you know. And so the singles done really well. And then yeah, doing a video at the moment, which is taking a bit of time, but you know, whatever it was. Yeah, I’m not. I’m not stressing about it, just happy that someone wants to do or do a video with us about it. And so yeah, that’s it. And then we’re just like, the next thing for me with a single is always trying to hustle a bit more for syncs, you know that kind of placement, or because I feel like it’s a song that really lends itself to that. Jacqueline Norton: Totally. So the song is called ?. Hattie Murdoch: It’s called Rubicon and and it’s out on all major digital distributors, and Spotify, Apple Music, all that kind of thing Tidal. I think it’s on Tidal and, and on my Bandcamp as well actually it’s on my Bandcamp as well We’ll put all the links below, afterwards so that everybody can see. What’s the next single?. So I am I’m in two minds like Jacqueline Norton: You’ve a choice of five. So you might not know yet Hattie Murdoch: What’s funny is that all my songs seem to start with an S except for Rubicon is the first song in like, three years, I haven’t started doing this. Anyway, to counteract that I’ve got another one called Still another one called Simple. So you know, we’re just getting some SS in there. And so I know I’m not sure there’s something I wrote at the beginning of the year on my own. And I’m just you know, it’s there, it’s demoed, I just need to do a little tweak. And, but with I’ve done a 90 day plan, you’ll love this. I’ve taken your spreadsheet and actually done a year, I’ve done goals for up to a year, all the different areas of my businesses and I’m really sat down and really plan stuff in and so regardless of what the next single is going to be, I am going to send it to the producer next week. So could be called Pale Hands, could be Still could be Simple. Jacqueline Norton: Yeah. Good. That’s all fantastically positive. And I’m so pleased, I personally adore Rubicon because I think it’s epic. I urge everybody to, to have a listen, because it’s a real class piece of work. Hattie Murdoch: So thank you so much. And it probably wouldn’t have come out if it hadn’t been for you. Honestly, it probably would be sat in my back pocket going, I’ve got a single I’m gonna put out soon. Jacqueline Norton: that makes me so happy. Yes, I, my core motivator, you know, ever since I’ve started working with and meeting musicians and artists, is I would hate for your talent not to be heard, for the sake of a few business skills, you know, and the discipline around that. So that makes me incredibly proud and happy. So thank you. And I appreciate Hattie Murdoch: that. No, no, and I appreciate it so much, though, you know, you’re open to my scattiness and just could sort that. I think there’s a huge part of this as well, which I’ve thought about a lot over the last. Probably since our session, because you said something about resistance when you start feeling resistance to something. You’re like, why am I doing this? Why am I procrastinating about something, and really, that resistance is usually fear. And I think that that’s been really important to be for me too, because this has gone across, you know, all of my whole different parts of my life. If I’m finding resistance and things I’m like, right, okay, what is it recognise it? Is it fear is it because it’s unknown or, and then you can start to work around it. And really, I felt like, you allowed me to overcome some fear by talking about it, like managing it into bite size chunks. And so really is what whatever issue, you know, people are having, whether it’s, you know, not sure of something and it’s like, you know that to talk it through with you, in such a gentle and understanding and constructive way is, has been the best the best takeaway really, I can get out of out of all of this. So Jacqueline Norton: No, thank you for that. And, you know, you’re right. I mean, it will definitely help other people that when you when you feel that resistance, that’s generally exactly what you need to be doing. Because our, ego mind is trying to protect us from failure, fear, success. Yeah, it’s different. It’s new, it’s, it’s scary. And so it’s generally, you know, we’re feeling that because, you know, it’s trying to keep us playing small because that’s where our comfort zone is. But we need to push through that and understand it and be kind of, you know, slightly non judgmental observer of where that feelings coming from and then understand it and then plan around it to gently do it anyway, you know, so, yeah, no, that’s really good self awareness. Yeah, Hattie Murdoch: yeah. And much appreciated, much needed. And when I moved into this new studio, I might get some better lighting. I realised that it’s been getting darker and darker and I look like a smurf really close up. So I’m really sorry about the lighting issue. Jacqueline Norton: But despite it being called Artists Spotlight, you’re kind of in the dark. Hattie Murdoch: I know I know the back is like I’m like, Ah, here I am everybody. Jacqueline Norton: In sillouhette Oh, well, we can see you and it’s lovely to do so. And we’ll we’ll draw it to a close there. But I really appreciate it Hattie. May you go on to massively bigger and better things because you proper deserve it. So well done. Hattie Murdoch: Thank you Jacq. Thank you so much. Yeah, really, really appreciate. Thanks for having us. Jacqueline Norton: No problem. My pleasure. Take care.